Do Any Current Drivers Belong In The All-Time Top Five?
Wednesday June 17, 2009
I was thinking about the top five NASCAR drivers of All-Time recently and discovered that there is only one active driver on my list. Jimmie Johnson, Tony Stewart, Kyle Busch, Mark Martin and the rest of today's stars may have a lot of talent but do any of them really belong in the same sentence with Dale Earnhardt and Richard Petty?
What do you think? Are there any all-time greats in the 2009 NASCAR Sprint Cup series other than Jeff Gordon?
Comments
I think Tony Stewart Is one of the all time greatest.He has been a champion in several different kinds of cars which is no easy thing to do.He’s won in Go-Karts,Midgets,Sprints,Indy cars and just about everything he has tried.
Top 5 drivers in the 2009 season, no. The only one that should be on the list is Richard Petty.
A top 5 list with only one driver on it. That’s an interesting take.
Okay Steve I’m confused, the question you ask is if any (current drivers) yet you think it should be only one (Dale Earnhardt) & BadBob thinks it should be the King! What part of CURRENT DRIVERS
Sorry about that, my fat finger hit the wrong key.
To finish, what part of current drivers is that is that? You know I vote for Smoke, he has won championships in everything from Go-Carts to Indy cars to NASCAR!!!
Go Tony Go
All time greats does not mean just in the last year, that is not all time. All time means since the beginning, hence, all time. Jeff Gordon is not all time, he may be current but is not all time. Dale Earnhardt was the “Intiminator” and Kyle Busch is an @$$ hole, but neither one is a all time driver.
You can’t use the words current and all time in the same sentence. All time includes everybody and current means only the drivers that are driving now, and that is not all time. Jeff Gordon is not an all time great, because his time is not yet up, maybe soon.
I have to believe that Dale Jr will ultimately be on the list just because of his enormous popularity and because of his name. I could be wrong, but I’m certainly not counting him out, even if he hasn’t won much over the last couple of years
Jeff Gordo certainly does not come anywhere close to being the driver Petty or Earnheardt were! Not to mention the rest of the nascar drivers from the last 40 years
Is it really about who folks think is the best all time driver or is this a way to get some haters to start bashing Jeff Gordon. I see they have started already. Sick of it.
It sure isn.t Jeff Gordon. When you have to cheat to win, you don,t belong with the great ones.
First of all let’s take Dale Earnhardt off the list and put him on the “Cheaters ” list. Thrn put Kyle Busch on the “Alltime Crybaby” list. I think time will show that Jimmie Johnson belongs on “The Top Five Drivers Of All Time” list
Jeff Gordon absolutely belongs on that list.
Other than that I believe that Jimmie Johnson will one day also belong on that list.
NO, none of the current drivers, they would all end up crying if they really had to compete with real drivers. These guys are nothing but a bunch of ball babies.All they can do is complain about their cars, SHUT_UP and drive like the old days!!!!!!!!
Trish,
Put the crack pipe down…..just put it down.
Give me one half baked reason that Jr. even remotely belongs anywhere near that list.
Jimmy is getting close. Three in a row will merit consideration.
There are 5 stand-out drivers in 09, but no all belong on the top 5 all-time list.
Jimmie Johnson, Carl Edwards, Tony Stewart, Kyle Busch and Mark Martin.
leadfoot said: “Nobody will know how stupid you are until you open your mouth and prove them right”.
How ironic that YOU of all people should use that quote. What most people refer to as Jeff Gordon “cheating” is the preferential treatment he has been given in the past by NASCAR officials. Here are just two examples that come to mind:
At Pocono in 2008, rein was pouring down and the race should have been stopped 5 laps earlier, however, just as Ryan Newman passed Gordon for the lead, NASCAR called the race and awarded Gordon the win.
In Texas that same year, on the last round of yellow flag pit stops, Mark Martin beat Gordon off of pit road by a car and a half, but Gordon was given the lead by NASCAR in the hopes that he could tie Dale Earnheart’s win record at Texas, a track he had never won at, it didn’t help that day as a superior driver suckered him into the wall.
Jeff Gordon is a great driver, but his record will always be tarnished by the treatment he received from NASCAR.
leadsfoot, you give good advise, you should take it too.
Leadfoot you are defintley in the top 5 when it comes 2 idiots commenting on nascar. Watch ur tv and keep ur mouth closed you obviosly know very little about the subject.
MattFan, not sure your argument holds any “rein” water.
First and foremost, a driver cannot “cheat” by a supposed call by NASCAR officials. A driver can only cheat by an act of his own doing or by an act of someone on his “team” that would give him an unfair advantage (i.e. an illegal part on his race car). Second, your examples are weak given all the technology NASCAR has for scoring and that Mark Martin could have beat somebody off pit road by 1-1/2 car lengths ( a huge amount ) and it be reversed by NASCAR. Remember, there are cameras at pit out to show driver placement, so that would dispute that argument.
If you don’t like Jeff Gordon that is fine, but to call him a cheater and have no hard evidence to support it is just being childish and jealous. I assume you are a Matt Kenseth fan which is all good because he is a great guy, a class act and a good racer. And, I am sure that he would have a different take than you on whether Jeff Gordon is a cheater or not. I, too, am a Matt Kenseth fan ( as well as a fan of alot of the drivers ) and enjoy seeing him win, but I am smart enough know reality and not let my rooting interest for a driver or team keep me from realizing it. If you are going to make a valid argument please have concrete evidence to support it and not let your favoritism blind you to the facts.
You folks are all evidence that the public has very limited ability to be objective at all, which is why your opinion matters so little. It scares me if you guys vote.
Top 5 of all time… based on what? Success? Wins? Earnings? Popularity? I’d say that in Nascar as in all sports, championships count the most, followed by total wins. Top 5 of all time is most certainly headed up by Richard Petty with 200 wins. Dale Sr. won 7 championships… so there is no arguing that point. If one of you wants to alledge that he was a cheater, then you are saying that you know better than NASCAR how to judge the sport, which I doubt. Jeff Gordon, is 6th on all time wins list, with 82 wins, with 4 championships. He’s 4th on all time pole’s list. He holds the record for road course wins (12), and the record for restrictor plate wins (12). He has 3 Daytona wins.Hard to argure with that. Were talking Nascar, so Stewarts go kart wins don’t count people. He is farther down the list with 2 titles and 34 wins in Sprint cup (Winston Cup). A great driver, yes. Top 5 in Nascar, No. The next two are hard to call. Bobby Allison, Darrel Waltrip and Cale Yarlborough are all hall of famers with 80+ wins, titles and storied careers. Has to be 2 of those 3.
Thank you Mark!!!! oh….and Go Jeff!
Have you ever heard so much whining !
Reminds me back in the day of stock car
racing at the local track here. Women would punch each other out because someone said somthing about thier driver.
Have a great race day!
other than Jeff Gordon. i would say maybe J.J. and Smoke. if it was not for the chase format Jeff Gordon would have six cups looking for his record tying seventh championship right now!! how? well K. Bush wouldnt have won his and J.J. would have only two. that is a true fact
It never surpises me on how many folks want to say this driver is a cheater or that driver is a cheater. They are ALL cheaters and history proves it. Petty, Earnhart, Gordon, Johnson and evern Smoke. I like them all, but they have all “bent” the rules and then acted as if they didn’t know anything about it. BS. As for Earnhart’s driving style, yes he was rough and didn’t take any BS from anyone, but all of the old drivers drove that way…including Petty. I can tell you they are all great drivers or they would be in the sport and that level. As for Kyle, he does seem to have some issues with keeping his opinions to himself and I don’t like what he says about the fans, weather they are Jr’s fans or not, but you can’t deny he can drive and her rarely cries about how his car is handling. I still can’t stand him as a person. I personaly like Dale Jr., Mark Martin and a few other mentioned above. As far as greatest drivers…I agree with Mark. you have to look at championships and wins.
Positive impact for the sport, championships, wins, all should be criteria. There are a few working on this nicely. Tony Stewart, Mark Martin even wo/championship, Jimmy Johnson, J. Gordon, all have the potential. The charity they support as well. Class acts in a sport any good republican can enjoy. Thanks to NASCAR we can still display TRUE AMERICANS KICKING ASS.
Certainly no drivers from Hendrick should be there. Nascar has always allowed that team to get away with cheating and that trend continues to this day.
I too am sick and tired of people whining about Jeff Gordon. He is a great driver…period!! I totally agree with everything Mark and Chuck M said. Jeff would have six championships right now if Nascar had left the point system alone. And I believe when history is written, there should be an asterisk by Jeff’s name noting that fact as well. This whole point system has really turned me off of Nascar somewhat.
Maybe an asterisk should be placed by all of the baseball players that bulked up with steroids and hit a ton of home runs. Cheating is cheating whether it is in Nascar or anything else.
I totally agree with coltsand24, I’m sick & tired of all the whining. It is true Gordon would have 6 championships if Nascar hadn’t changed the points system… What does that tell all of you morons?????? The points system really sucks…… Go 24
My heart just bleeds for that nice Jeff Gordon. He and his team would never do such an awful thing as to bend the rules in his favor. Poor guy, he is so misunderstood.
The biggest fallacy of all time rears its head again… There is no way to figure that Gordon would have six championships if the points format had not changed. He may have, but no one can make that statement with any certainty whatsoever.
The ONLY way that would necessarily be true is if every driver raced every race and finished in the exact same position whether there was a chase format or not. And we know that isn’t true. Strategies change within races and throughout the season because of the chase format. THAT affects the points overall.
Do you think Chad and Jimmie would have risked running out of gas the last two races under the old system? I think not. Because the new system allows those high up in the top-12 to take chances AND rewards wins the way it does, teams do things differently than they would have if there was no chase.
That’s not to say that Gordon might not have won six championships or more, but you can’t base your calculations based upon finishing positions and points during seasons that have had the chase. Simple logic and a little math dictate otherwise…
As for which current driver belongs in the all-time top-five, that is hard to say. Although I’m a Rowdy fanatic, I’d say Gordon with his four Championships and being as high on the all-time win list as he is, and still climbing. Johnson gets a vote as his win tally and three championships in a row trump what all but one other driver has been able to do (Cale Yarborough).
Kyle has a good chance, especially given that he’s good across all three series, but he’s also young and has many years of winning ahead of him. I think he’ll need a championship or three to get into that exclusive club, but I think those will come. Whether you like his personality or attitude or not, many of “the best” were not liked, were booed, and were not fan favorites for much if not most of their careers.
Stewart is another great, but I’m not sure yet if he’s one of the five greatest of all time. He may still prove himself worthy of being close, especially if he can pick up a third and maybe even a fourth championship.
And by all rights and means, if the universe were a cruel place, Mark Martin would come in second on the all-time list, just as he has come in second so many times–for championships for wins at so many tracks, for wins at Daytona, etc. But until he picks up a championship, he too is hard to put in that elite group.
I Feel that only Gorden Johnson Martin and Stewart
Goeden well he has won most championship Johnson for winning 3 in a row Stewart cause of the many differant types of championships
Martin Well He is the Number one IRCO champ He is what I would call the one of the best overall drives even if he has not won a Nascar championship and i dont think any one running today could last as long as he has
As far as Mark Martin. In 1990, a 46-point penalty at Richmond for using an illegal (but non-performance enhancing) carburetor spacer caused him to lose to Dale Earnhardt by 26 points in the final standings. Dont tell me he’s an alter boy. I might include him in a top 20 list but not all time top 5.
That’s such an ambiguous question. What determines an all-time driver? Most wins, most championships, outstanding consistancy, character, personality? It all depends on what you’re basing it on because there is a variety of drivers that may qualify for any of these categories. I really don’t think one driver is overall the best.
The answer, NO. The current drivers have not yet reached ALL-TIME, so no. Current and all time can not be used in the same sentence because they contradict each other.
Awesome Bill, you have to put him in there somewhere.
what kind of response is “none of the above drivers have reached ‘ALL-TIME’?” think about what you are writing. NOBODY will ever reach ALL-TIME if you want to get picky about it, as when time finally ends, none of us will be asking any such questions…
the question was a simple one–do any of the current drivers, where they stand now, belong in the top five of all-time? maybe you think none of them do and that’s fine. maybe you think a couple might before their careers end, that’s fine too.
but to not answer the question by invoking cheap arguments over semantics (and then to invoke them as far as suits your purposes) is a waste of your time to write it and everybody else’s time to read it.
Wow! Some of you people are thinking way to hard into this. I almost ruptured a blood vessel reading this. The only one to me that makes any sense is Mark. You have to base it off of wins and championships that would make sense. You could argue that any driver that wins or has a couple of championships would be a candidate but to be considered great i think that only time could tell that. They may be doing well now but they might not do so well in years to come. I really do beleive that Petty and Earnhardt set the bar. I dont think having 2 or 4 championships are good enough. I know some people will get upset because they have some favorite drivers that have won alot of races and have a few championships but lets be real here to be considered great or the best dont you have to be the best…And youre record will speak for you!